EP5: Is Perfection Your Blessing Or Curse?

Well, I mean, this is coming off the heels of the journey to self-mastery we talked about and constant never-ending improvement. It's coming off of our podcast where we talked about building the perfect business, you know, contractor business community, right? So at some point, if you're trying to create something amazing, you're striving for perfection. And at some point you go too far and that's when it becomes a curse. And then sometimes when you bring it right to the edge of being a curse or a blessing, when you're right on the cliff, that's when the magic happens. You got to find the magic. Got to find that breaking point.

Yes. Yes. Go ahead. No, no, listen. That's what's the beauty of this.

What's perfect for me is maybe a mess for you. And what's perfect for you is a mess for me. So it's very subjective.

no. I just spent a week with you in Florida. It's a little bit annoying what's perfect for you.

worst three days of my life.

Look, you left Florida smiling more than you did in three days in the past three years. Just admit it.

But that's what I'm talking about. Like what's perfect for one person is not perfect for the other. And so, you know, look, we've talked about developing a... I guess I'm throwing the secret out there, but we've developed, we're working on developing a tracking system for our community to, you know, just track progress and goals and daily affirmations and things like that. And what's perfect for me is different than you. And so we have to, you know, try and figure out where that lands, you know, just because like we're, we're business partners in this, but like we have to find that, that happy medium in the middle. And then we're always walking on that cliff looking for that magic moment.

No one's without fault or defect, I believe, but satisfying requirements. You know, it's interesting because when we started talking about doing this podcast, I was like, well, what is perfect, right? What can I define perfect in my life? You know who I thought of? I think you might be surprised. Me? No, it wasn't you. I thought of Gordon Ramsay. Like he wants perfection in his kitchen, right? Think about Hell's Kitchen and making the perfect filet or the perfect eggs benedict. His level of perfectionism is amazing, right? So you get this dish, you eat it, it tastes perfect. It comes out at the perfect time with all the rest of the meal. I think they reach perfection. That's what I thought of.

But did the eggs Benedict taste the same?

So, I mean, I don't know. I don't know the guy you speak of. He must be a nobody.

Well, I think, I think it's a re you know, it's not reality TV is not really reality. So in some of the other things I've seen Gordon do, he seems like a pretty cool dude. I mean, I think he's, he's pretty fun. I think he's a little over the top for the show, just for the show. But again, I'm speculating that, but the reality is like, I believe you can make the perfect dish, the perfect texture, the perfect. temperature, the perfect cut, the perfect, I believe they achieve it.

by the top chefs in the world standards.

Well, I mean, listen, if it was liver, I probably wouldn't like it that much. Right. Look, I mean, when top professionals create an excellence, a standard of excellence, I mean, how can you mess with that? I mean, I would never look at the perfect, you know, lemon meringue from Gordon Ramsay as not being perfect. Maybe I didn't like lemon. Personally, I love lemon. But I'm just saying, like, my wife doesn't really like lemon. So she might take a bite of it and go, eh, I don't really like it. But it's probably the perfect temperature, the perfect consistency, the perfect ingredients. excellent industry standards. So I think we're going too deep on the food item. I mean, I want to bring this back to contracting and to your business.

Well, I guess that's going to come down to your sales process and the discovery call and figuring out what... what standard is that they want. And you'd be saying, hey, industry standard is the number five, da, da, da, whatever for drywall. And this is how the finish was going to be. And they might be like, oh, I really want orange peel. And you might be like, well, orange peel is out. It's not that cool anymore. They're like, I don't care. When I was a kid, I had orange peel and I like it. That's what I want. That's my perfection. And you go, okay, you want orange peel? I can give you orange peel, no problem. And so that happens in the discovery of your sales call, right? So I think that's worked out that way. You can still probably deliver a perfect orange peel finish.

I have a good story to tie into this. So check this out. This is a weird moment for me. When I'm out building ponds with my crew, I'm trying to empower my team. I'm trying to give them the go ahead. I don't just come in and go, I'm here to build the waterfall, everybody. Like I'm not this prima donna, like roll up, like, look out, I'm building the waterfall. You did all the hard work. So I did this one project and, you know, I knew the client pretty well. There was two waterfalls on the project and I was like, okay, I'm going to build a waterfall on this with my team. And so I remember when we went in to build the waterfall, I kind of gave a little bit of freedom on the first waterfall as a team project. It was like a team development. Hey, move this rock. What do you think about that? What do you think about this? Now we went to the second waterfall. I was like, I'm going to do what I want here because it's going to, it'll differentiate. So the two waterfalls look very different. And so I took what I thought in my mind was perfect for this application. And I made this skinny, tall waterfall next to the other like wider, shorter waterfall. So visually contrast, composition wise, I think I set up the rocks just like perfect. And, you know, I set up the waterfall up taller. So it was just, I just thought it was great. One side that I did with the team was kind of like splashing and falling, like imagine like a whitewater rapid kind of thing, right? So this one on the left-hand side, we elevated it, and I made this sheer descent, skinny, interesting. It was completely different contrast, different audio, different all this stuff. And when I was done, I was like, this shit is sick. I love this, right? Customer comes out. The wife hates it. She hates the skinny little waterfall. And I was, I swear, I was pissed. I was like, I shouldn't have just let my guys do this. I shouldn't have put my perfection on this. Because they did want something. They wanted what was right for them. So me as an artist, here it is. Artistic-wise, I've built all these different waterfalls. I felt like this was the perfect setting, the perfect application, perfect composition. Client comes out, doesn't like it. This is not eggs benedict. This is not lemon meringue pie where the texture and temperature is perfect, right? So the lady comes out and she's like, yeah, it's too skinny. I just don't like it. And I was like super pissed, right? But I'm like, okay, all right. I just got to give them what they want. I told my guys, I'm like, just change the waterfall. Do whatever the fuck you want because I'm done. I'm not touching this waterfall. I'm not going to screw up my perfect waterfall. Like, I'm not going to screw it up. You guys screw it up. So I let my guys do it. This is what was really interesting. I let the guys do it. They move the waterfall around. They change it up. The lady comes out. She's like, oh my God, I love it. She's all super happy. Then my guys were just like, oh, like, dude, you should have seen their chest. They were just like, Boom, boom, boom, pounding their chest. They're all pumped. Like they're so stoked that they, you know, they made the lady happy and I didn't. So it was super empowering for my team and super demoralizing to me. But I was like, this turned out to be good. It was a bad thing. Turned it into an opportunity to empower my team. And I took the L and I still got paid. So it was okay.

Yeah, my personality, you know that. But I mean, like, here's the thing is that I poured my heart into it. I wasn't just like, like, hey, I really want to, I really want to make something interesting. And I was like, but me as an artist, see, as an artist, that's what's so interesting because art could look like total crap to one person, look amazing to someone else. Right. And that's the difference between art and food. But when it comes back to hanging a window, the perfection would be it's got to be plumb. It's got to be level. It's got to be centered on the house correctly. It's got to be in the right spot. And the drywall, there shouldn't be any joints showing like that. There's a level of perfection that's in an industry standard that everyone should be pleased with. And the normal person would be pleased with.

Well, I mean, if the window doesn't open correctly because it's not plumb, then yeah, that's a problem.

Yeah, but again, I don't totally agree with you on that because... While I believe that you can't necessarily ever achieve perfection, if you're constantly making adjustments to try and be better, you are becoming a better and better person and better at your craft and better in relationships and all that. So am I a perfect human being? No, but I believe I'm perfect for my wife. I'd like to think that she thinks the same until, you know, I fart in bed at nighttime and she doesn't think that's very perfect, but I'm perfect for her. And she's perfect for me, but I'm not a perfect human being.

Well, it could be. Striving for perfection is a blessing.

You're always going to be able to be better, no matter what. You'll always be able to get better, faster, cleaner.

Sure, but there's certain parts of your business where that does make sense. And there's a spot in that for pond construction. And I imagine for any other types of construction as well. and business and so forth. That is the truth. But striving for perfectionism in like a personal sport and personal health and wellness and all that stuff, I don't think there's a spot unless, I mean, sure, you can go too far in anything. Too much of anything is bad.

So I know where you're getting to. Listen, I know where you're getting to. You're getting to Gitmo. So let's just Gitmo and get on with it. Get on with the Gitmo and teach people. Yeah, teach people about Gitmo.

You can go 70 yards and get a field goal, but I still want to get the touchdown.

Well, yeah, but no one does that.

Yeah, but you don't throw 80 yards, you know. You run it. You pitch it to the running back and you run. What if you're down by three? You want seven. You don't want to feel good.

listen. See, here's the problem I have with Gitmo. I do have a problem with Gitmo because I understand there are certain times. Because you're a perfectionist. Well, I don't think I'm a perfectionist. I really am not.

Well, that's an art that's different because I know it's subjective to the way it looks. And I want to talk about that some more, but there's a certain point where, hey, it is good enough to move on. Okay. So, you know, I think the biggest argument you and I ever had when I literally wanted to strangle you and you probably wanted to smash my head was in a Gitmo situation in us developing the podcast and. the profit club and the sales system that we're developing. And I think that was a, that was a defining moment for us to understand each other. But there's a certain point where it's like, okay, I understand this is the website's at a spot where it's good enough to move on and let's work on the podcast. And then that's good enough and let's get it to move on. But sometimes I'm only at the 50 yard line. I, you know, maybe you think you're at, we're at 70, but I'm only at 50 and I want to get to 70, but my 70 is 90 to you. And you think it's. You know, it's too much. So that's when two different personalities on the other sides of the country have to try and realize, hey, am I at, are you at Gitmo? Am I at Gitmo? What if you are and I'm not? So like as a business and you might relate, this might become relatable to your clients and to your customers. Is this right? Is this Gitmo?

Let me tie this to the profit sales system because. This is going to be funny to you. I don't think I ever met the woman. This was before we really had our sales process defined. I never even spoke to the woman. I only spoke to the man, worked out the deal. I didn't even communicate with her. So maybe I could have, if I felt like I had creative freedom. So my communication skills were lacking still. Again, it's pre-profit sales system times. And then it bit me. I thought I had the creative freedom, but I didn't because I didn't communicate well enough. And that's what I love about, you know, our core four system and communication with our clients. I think that's key. And I like that this just tied to that.

well, I'd be less likely to make that mistake. I'm not perfect, so I'm always screwing up.

So my thing with GetMo, and this is relatable right to the podcast and the hammer and grind journey that we're on right now, it's like, I do think there's certain things that we've done that are GetMo that'll help us move the, take the needle along forward until we're in a better position to... head backwards and maybe make some corrections and move it back along. And I don't necessarily have to have them perfect, but I do want them to be better. I don't want to get, I don't want to just, I'm nervous that some people might get into the get mo standard and they're like, oh, this is good enough to move on. Oh, well, this is good enough to move on. Well, I want to make sure we're in that constant never-ending improvement mentality. Is it get mo or is it not? Does that make sense?

So listen, I've turned over projects to my team and said, look, I'm empowering you. I've taught you what I can. This is where we're at. This job's yours. I'm not going to influence. I'm not going to touch anything. I'll even go to the job site and they'll be like, hey, what do you think about this rock? I'm like, I think you're in charge is what I think. I think this is your waterfall. And I just let them go. And then I leave and then I come back and I might come back to the job site and go, oh, water level is probably an inch different than I would have liked to have seen it. Oh, waterfall is okay. I mean, it looks all right. You know, I mean. Should I make an adjustment? Am I going to hurt their feelings? Am I going to take the empowerment away from them that I gave to them? And all this stuff's going through my head and the client walks out and they're like, oh my God, it's beautiful. You know, like, I'm like, okay, cool. She loves it. My guys are empowered. I don't want to let my vision of perfection, you know, ruin it for the lady. She's happy. Ruin it for my team. They're happy. And that's their journey to self-mastery. And I empower them to take that step. And maybe they're at the 40 yard line and I want to get them to 70. And maybe that's not the right time to move them to 40. They just, you know, when we're done and we're at the back at the headquarters and we're sipping on a beer and I'd be like, hey, this would be my challenge to them. I'd be like, hey, you guys did amazing today. I got a question for you. If you could do one or two things different to maybe make that pond better, what would you guys do? Let's talk about that. And then get them to start thinking about. you know, adjustments that they might take. And that, that takes me to making adjustments to perfection. And I know perfection is not attainable to anybody, unless you're Gordon Ramsay and you do a lemon meringue, but making adjustments that, that would be a way to get them to make adjustments. And then I might just go, you know what I would have liked to seen, I would have loved it if the water level was up, like maybe an extra inch. I think that would have made a really cool difference. What do you think? And then, then get them to talk about it and explore it.

So did the guys.

So I just want to be clear on something like part of that was all in aesthetics, beauty, you know, those kind of things. So if it had functionality problems.

Yeah. If it's a functionality issue, then I'm going to step in and go like this. You need to make this correction right now. You know, water level is one thing is if it's within a certain range, I'm going to be okay. But I prefer it one way. You know, it's one of my pet peeves, but if functionality is jeopardized, then they're fixing it right then and there, right? So I do want to talk about making adjustments because making adjustments to head towards perfection is part of our journey to self-mastery and the constant and never-ending improvement. So I want to relate this to your competition shooting. I think this might move you in a fashion because you're constantly making adjustments. If you have to get faster, if you're not hitting the target, correctly, if you're shooting too low or too much to the right, you have to make those adjustments, whether it's in the way your holster is, if it's got the right cant or not. If the cant is incorrect on your holster, you have to make that adjustment so it comes out of the holster correctly. You have to make an adjustment where your hand is so when you present the firearm towards the target, everything's fast and closer to being perfect. Right? How does that taste?

Tastes like lead. But you see what I'm saying, right? And if you were going to coach someone, if you were going to coach me how to be a competitive shooter, you would be showing me all these small adjustments, just like when I was training my team, how to... I wouldn't. You wouldn't what?

If I was paying you as a coach, hey, I want to be better at competitive. I want to be a better golfer. I'd hire a golf instructor. He would teach me the adjustments in my hips and my feet placement and my hand holding. If I was paying an instructor, they would make those adjustments for me. They would help me make those adjustments.

sure. It's all incremental. You know, you can't teach every, I can't teach everyone how to build a perfect pond right from the get go, but I have that apprentice on hand. I'd be like, hold the shovel this way. Okay, cool. And then I let them go for a while. They use the shovel and then I'd be like, Hey, just turn the wheelbarrow in this direction. It's going to be more efficient and you'll be, you won't be as tired at the end of the day, make this small adjustment and on and on and on. And so that's what the golf instructor would do. Or hopefully the shooting instructor would say, Hey, this is the adjustment. This is where I want your hand. Touch the hand to your stomach as you're going to grab the holster so your hand is already in position. That adjustment is going to help you make the presentation smoother and quicker. So you can't tell them all in one sitting. It's incremental.

It's one of the things I hate about you, Brad.

Well, that's why it's a blessing to me and it's a curse to you.

good. I mean, you're speechless. Yeah, you're speechless because I just dropped the fire on your face.

Well, I mean, we covered making adjustments, Einsights 2020. I mean, that's like oftentimes when you release something, and I did this with my pond skimmer. I mean, I poured everything into this mold, you know, and got the mold like the way I thought was going to be perfect. And I went to market on it. And then once you make that mold, there's not really many adjustments you can make. Although, you know, I can do some secondary operations on the skimmer to make some adjustments. You know, there's certain times when you get your rough draft, you have to go to market and then you have to make changes later. And you make those changes because hindsight's 20-20. You're like, oh, I wish I would have done this. Let's make a change. Let's make an adjustment. And that gets you closer to, you know, this taking the perfect crap.

Sure. I mean, the same thing can be said about ponds. I want to spend this into the profit club and let's talk about that for a minute. Because in the last podcast we talked about, does the perfect contractor business community exist? And I think we've done, made some big steps towards perfection, you know, moving in that direction. Maybe we never hit perfection, but I think we've developed a pretty good. group of contractors that all are on their own journey to self-mastery that like a community, a family of people looking to head towards perfection. Wouldn't you agree?

We know that.

right. Well, this is what I want to kind of throw out there. I want to challenge everyone who's listened to the podcast, who put up with Brad this long. I want you to evaluate a couple areas of your life. You know, maybe when you've gone, you know, you could have gone harder towards perfection. And then maybe sometimes you went too far. Maybe the 70 yard line was good enough and you were pushing for the 100 yard, you know,100 yard line. I'd like for you to evaluate that. And I want this to go from like business development to job site experiences and possibly even relationships with your family and friends and spouse and so forth. And we'd love to get your feedback on that. I know. I'd like to share with you that Facebook and Instagram is probably the best way for you to communicate those with us currently. But we'd love to challenge you. If you're listening to this podcast, you are looking to be on a journey to self-mastery. You want to be better. You want to strive for perfection. And even if it's maybe not attainable, we know who you are because you're still here. So we want to kind of challenge you for that. And we'd love to get your feedback over on Instagram or Facebook.

Well, that's going to be funny because it's going to be some people are going to be like it's a blessing and other people are going to be it's a curse. And I do want to give a big shout out to my boy, Aaron Keams, because he listened to one of our podcasts and he had said, hey, it would be cool if you gave people homework. I mean, and so I jumped on it. I thought it was a great idea. And that's part of this community. That's part of being around people who want to be better and challenge each other. You know, he challenged me to challenge you. And so big shout out to my boy, Aaron Keams, on that one. So, yeah, we want to hear from you if you have any challenges. Yeah. If you have any challenges for us to help make the groups better, we'd love to hear it from you guys for sure.

All right, we're out. Thank you so much for lending us your attention and your ears today. If you enjoyed the podcast and you're finding value, it would mean the world to us. If you just took a moment to give us a review, subscribe, and of course, smash that five-star rating. It helps the position of the podcast and ratings and so forth. Please follow us over on Facebook and Instagram. The handle is at hammerandgrindpodcast. And if you're interested in learning more about the Profit Club and the Profit Sales System that we've talked about, jump on over to hammerandgrind. com, click on the menu, and you'll find the Profit Club and the sales system and all those wonderful things there. And of course, you can subscribe to get updates just by putting in your email address. So without further ado, we're going to take off and keep up the hammer, keep up the grind. We'll see you on the next download.